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Poetics and Poetry Discussion

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  • Solitary Man (3/31/2005 6:04:00 AM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    Surely, everything is relative. I know people who would not rate their very favourite films, poems, etc. as being more than a '9', suggesting that (philosophically speaking) a '10' should be unattainable. I have given a '10' to a few things because, in my book, a '10' is an acknowledgement that the poem achieves everything it set out to do, and does not fall short. It seems to me that this is a fair way of assessing a piece. Otherwise, if one was to only class Dante or Shakespeare (for example) as a benchmark...everybody would be lucky to get passed 1/10! For example, if one injures oneself accidentally...a person could be extremely eloquent and quote Goethe...or one could perfectly encapsulate the moment with a well-timed, mono-syllabic expletive. I'd give the expletive 10/10 in that situation.

    I think Michael Sheperd is right when he says that ratings are not something to get hung up about. It allows some people to gain a little confidence (which can only be a positive thing) ...and ultimately...if one is not happy with a certain line in a poem that they wrote...all the 10/10's in the world are not going to change their mind. Conversely, if one receives lots of stinking 1/10's but you think that you got the poem to where you wanted to take it...why worry about ratings?

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    • Janice M Pickett (3/31/2005 6:30:00 AM) Post reply | Read 2 replies

      I think everyone is so hung up on numbers that they have forgotten the basic principles. If you enjoy something very much you give it the highest score on the site which is ten. Not because ten means ... more

  • louis sacre croix (3/30/2005 8:51:00 PM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    I know that some poets like to be rated, but surely a good honest evaluation is better.
    Always happy to hear from others about a particular piece so long as it is honest and fair minded, based on the work and not on how one feels about the poet or any particulars about the poet's background.

    Warm regards


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    • Alexa Greenwood (3/30/2005 11:33:00 PM) Post reply

      Personally I like my poems being rated, it is one reason I started posting them here. BTW when a poem is by nature unclear is it a good idea to add information regarding details of the poem? Alexa ... more

  • ***** ***** (3/30/2005 7:50:00 PM) Post reply

    That's twice that Mary Oliver has made me cry with her words tonight.. the ratings here mean nothing - to those of us who really hear.

  • louis sacre croix (3/30/2005 7:21:00 PM) Post reply

    I apologise!
    Someone should try to correct my punctuation and grammar, it is abominable!


  • Lenchen Elf (3/30/2005 6:26:00 PM) Post reply | Read 3 replies

    O Joy, I've just discoveredMary Olivers's beautiful: -)

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    • Lenchen Elf (3/30/2005 6:57:00 PM) Post reply

      Hi Joell I don't have a clue I'm afraid, though if it was a third party I'm immensely grateful, I doubt I would have found her work otherwise.

    • ***** ***** (3/30/2005 6:34:00 PM) Post reply

      I completely agree Lenchen. Isn't she fantastic? But I'm curious, is this how the work of more established poets is normally posted? In other words, would it be she who is adding to her P/H collection ... more

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  • Herbert Nehrlich1 (3/30/2005 6:25:00 PM) Post reply | Read 1 reply

    How do I find her? ? ? ? ?
    I was doing a yoga thingy the other day (to prove that I was so young still) and ended up head over heels.
    With thousands of new poems posted I will try to find her poems to get me back into
    that position.

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  • Herbert Nehrlich1 (3/30/2005 5:48:00 PM) Post reply

    And I must say that the more I read of Lare's book the more I am fascinated.
    Haiku - don't ask me until I get there, so far it is Greek to me (the Rhodos Dialect) .
    Is there not a run on your book yet Lare?

  • Lare Austin (3/30/2005 5:30:00 PM) Post reply

    I think, Sherrie, that once one understands the structure/format of entire new wonderful world opens...I would be the first to say that I am not the best at it...but I very much enjoy writing Haiku...In my poetry book I have an enitre chapter devoted to Haiku...mistake? I'll let you be the judge...


  • Herbert Nehrlich1 (3/30/2005 4:25:00 PM) Post reply

    Thanks Sherrie, you make excellent points. Although Siggie Freud has well and truly been consigned to the heap by the backdoor of psychology and psychiatry...
    As to rhyming, in my younger years I understood poetry to be rhymes, period.
    Johann Wolfgang, Friedrich, Heinrich, Hoffmann von, Gottfried....they all rhymed exclusively. I found it to be a challenge but often a bit of a struggle to get the stupid words to rhyme and of course I ended up having to change the meaning, sometimes the entire message of a poem because I couldn't find the proper rhyming word. Often, I did not know how the poem would turn out as the absence or presence of a word would steer the poem into a new direction.
    This is still the case with me regardless of what I write, I start out and let the adventure take me.
    What I find when I read the work of others on P/H is that rhymes more often than not mean I, the reader can tell the author's struggle and how (s) he 'forced' the words in, leaving little meaning or flow or rhythm in the poem.
    I love experimenting with various styles and will be forever grateful to a poet on this site who singlehandedly 'introduced' me to the world of poetry, the one beyond rhymes for birthdays and other occasions.
    With fewer than 10 more serious poems written in the 60's I started on this venture in July,2004, infatuated over both ears with the poet and trying very hard to impress her.
    So what I have so far written is the stuff of a true greenhorn, one who is looking for new ways of expressing thoughts in poetry, and I must say that I now prefer the non-rhyming kind, especially when I want to 'say' something.
    I have done a few mixed-language poems, meaning every other line was in either German or English. Might add French or Russian to it but that is harder.

  • louis sacre croix (3/30/2005 4:20:00 PM) Post reply

    How would one choose a great poet?

    Does mass reading make one great?

    Maybe it is mass media?

    I personally prefer to think and choose greatness for myself and recognise individuals personally and not for what the masses are stating about them.

    Some certainly must stand the test of time, however I wonder who would have heard of Shakespeare if John Smith had been the one favoured at court!

    JJ Jamison, lately found to be a double murderer from MA, will he gain or lose favour with his following?

    I do not claim to be an expert, all I know is that to be considered famous, it would seem you must be O K enough to appeal to the ordinary man (does that mean your work cannot be extraordinary) or you must be quite famous for something else entirely (so that at least your name will sell a book) .

    Sadly greatness and great worth do not seem to run on the same track except on very rare occasions, or when you are already dead!


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